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gorori
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PostSubject: controller setting for fighting games   Fri 04 Sep 2009, 3:44 pm

Please tell me.
The array of buttons which you like of fighting games. Question
And your good idea.

----------
example

No,1
Like a Capcom? 6buttons
A:Light punch B:Light kick C:Middle punch D:Middle kick E:Heavy punch F:Heavy kick
Combo A⇔B→C⇔D→EorF

No,2
Like a KOF? 4buttons
A:Light punch B:Light kick C:Heavy punch D:Heavy kick
Combo A⇔B→CorD

No,3
Other
A:Punch B:kick C:Light Weapon D:Heavy Weapon
Combo AorB→C→D

No,4
Other
A:Light attack B:Middle attack C:Heavy attack D:Special action(not Hyper combo)
Combo A→B→C
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RayguardKnight (SS7)
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PostSubject: Re: controller setting for fighting games   Fri 04 Sep 2009, 6:59 pm

The important thing for me is the ability for the player to customize the controls himself. Most fighting games allow the player to change which buttons do what or reset to default. I realize that's not so easy from a programming standpoint, but you should consider it.

Of course there's still the problem of a default control scheme. I prefer the six-button layout (eg, Street Fighter).

What programming language / software are you using for your project anyway?
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ssfsx17
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PostSubject: Re: controller setting for fighting games   Fri 04 Sep 2009, 8:13 pm

I prefer 4 buttons - because the majority of controllers have 4 buttons on the face. In order to play a 6-button game well, I have to get one of those special joysticks, which are very expensive over time.
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RayguardKnight (SS7)
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PostSubject: Re: controller setting for fighting games   Fri 04 Sep 2009, 8:54 pm

ssfsx17 wrote:
I prefer 4 buttons - because the majority of controllers have 4 buttons on the face. In order to play a 6-button game well, I have to get one of those special joysticks, which are very expensive over time.

Actually you're right. I completely forgot that Street Fighter actually has six buttons on the face at the arcade. huh

What I was thinking about was Street Fighter on Game Boy, for example, which tried to squeeze a system made for six buttons into a four button layout. Also had in mind Fatal Fury 1 on the SNES. If I remember correctly (been awhile) it used only three face buttons. I still prefer a game that uses six buttons though, even if two are shoulder buttons.
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HeromanX
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PostSubject: Re: controller setting for fighting games   Sat 05 Sep 2009, 3:43 am

I vastly prefer a six-button system. I've played on four-button systems (ala Tekken) and having a fast but weak, balance, and strong but slow attack is really nice, especially when you get into the extremely technical stuff like hit frames and priority.

To point out, the original Street Fighter game only had one button and a joystick. How hard the button was pressed determined the strength of the attack while everything else was handled from the joystick. The later cabinets did feature two buttons for the two different strengths of attacks, however, and it was in Street Fighter II that the concept of a weak/medium/strong punch/kick system was implemented.

Also, while a lot of purists do get arcade joysticks to play their fighting games (six-button system or not), most modern console controllers are extremely well-mapped for fighting games too. I personally like the PS setup and usually have it mapped as such:

X - Light Kick
[] - Light Punch
O - Medium Kick
/_\ - Medium Punch
R2 - Heavy Kick
R1 - Heavy Punch
L2 - L/M/H Kick
L1 - L/M/H Punch
R3 - Grab (or Guard Break in SF EX3)
L3 - Grab (SF EX3 only)
D-Pad - Movement

For me, at least, it feels really comfortable with this map since all I have to do is pull my right index or middle fingers to pull off heavy attacks and I can use my right thumb for light and medium attacks (or for manual input of the R3/L3 commands). Using all three at once is made simple by using shoulder buttons so I don't have to try putting my thumb in funky positions just to pull off super combos.

Also, gorori, I can't read some of the text in your post, which I'm presuming is some form of Japanese (either Hiragana or Katakana, I'm also presuming). I'm getting things like " A⇔B→C⇔D→" instead of whatever the input was (that particular example was taken from the last line under the No. 1 example). I don't know if it's just me, and it's not really a huge matter, but something to note as it's untranslatable gibberish in its current form. ^^;
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evilReiko
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PostSubject: Re: controller setting for fighting games   Sat 05 Sep 2009, 9:06 am

I agree with HeromanX, I used to play Tekken and Bloody Roar, and it's fun to use all possible buttons (6 or even 8 buttons lol ). but these games are played on playstation, now imagine we will play these games on PC, with 8 buttons! ..... that's horrible fear i think it's better with 4 in PC happy

there are some factors you should consider:

- game platform (in this case, it's a computer game happy )
- game type (obviously fighting game razz )
- game style (weapons-style / monsters-style / naked-hands-style / etc)

a Valis fighting game style will obviously have weapons-style game, so.. having [light punch, high punch, light kick, high kick] and only 1-button for weapon will make it completely non-sense lol I mean... imagine Yuko of Valis 1 holding Valis but fighting by punching and kicking all the time.. that's just ridiculous lol

so.. in this case of a Valis fighting game in PC, I think option No.4 could be the best, or even No.3 is not bad too Smile
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HeromanX
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PostSubject: Re: controller setting for fighting games   Sat 05 Sep 2009, 11:50 am

Yeah...I didn't even take the platform into consideration. ^^; Also, I have a PS2 controller for my PC so I'm accustomed to playing with that (playing Ys: Oath in Felghana turned out to be a beast on the keyboard in comparison).

However, I've played Touhou 10.5: Scarlet Weather Rhapsody, which is a Touhou fighting game that uses four attack buttons with two special buttons. With that said, using the AS/ZX attack setup (using a QWERTY keyboard) while using D/C for special combinations would be ideal in my opinion.

As for the girls punching and kicking instead of swinging swords, think of it as like playing Samurai Shodown - instead of "punching", Yuko & Co. would use their weapons, but they would still have kicks. And heavens know how much I love my Samurai Shodown. heh-heh
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RayguardKnight (SS7)
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PostSubject: Re: controller setting for fighting games   Sat 05 Sep 2009, 11:54 am

Quote :
a Valis fighting game style will obviously have weapons-style game, so.. having [light punch, high punch, light kick, high kick] and only 1-button for weapon will make it completely non-sense lol I mean... imagine Yuko of Valis 1 holding Valis but fighting by punching and kicking all the time.. that's just ridiculous

I understand what you're saying but I don't think that's what Gorori was referring to at all. Notice that his first two examples don't even mention weapons. Yet he obviously he realizes that his game will have swordplay. The commands he gave are just representative and are not what he is actually going to use in his game.

However, even true weapon-based fighters will make use of some physical combat. Eg, Soul Calibur. There will probably be one or two punch/kick buttons anyway (which makes a six-button layout even more attractive).

Quote :
I used to play Tekken and Bloody Roar, and it's fun to use all possible buttons (6 or even 8 buttons lol ). but these games are played on playstation, now imagine we will play these games on PC, with 8 buttons! ..... that's horrible fear i think it's better with 4 in PC

Well, most PC controllers have ample buttons to support a six-button layout. Like I said, four face buttons and two triggers or shoulder buttons.

Why would that be horrible? Most PC controllers are practically identical to the Playstation controller. The one here on my desk cost me like 15$ and it has four face buttons and four shoulder buttons a la Playstation.

Samurai Shodown used a vertical slash button, stab button, and two kick buttons (although they did the same thing). If the vertical slash and stab were hit simultaneously you got a strong slash. And if the two kick buttons were hit simultaneously you got a strong kick. So in effect you had five commands: weak kick, strong kick, weak attack, medium attack, and strong attack.

So I don't see a contradiction between a six button config and weapon-based combat.

And I don't think anyone is seriously considering eight buttons at this point either.

(NOTE: I wrote this post about the same time HeromanX wrote his. The Samurai Shodown part may seem redundant but the fact we were both thinking the same thing is interesting.)
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gorori
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PostSubject: Re: controller setting for fighting games   Sat 05 Sep 2009, 3:28 pm

I am sorry to be unclear.

to HeromanX

Both can be used. =1.

1st
Combo AB=1 next CD=1 next EorF.
2nd
Combo AB=1 next CorD.
3rd
Combo AorB next C next D.
4th
Combo A next B next C.

to evile Reiko.

It is because i wanted to distinguish the 3rd punch and arms.
The 1st and the 2nd punch are set as arms.
Depending on the case, a kick button may be set as arms.

For example.
a down key and a heavy kick button are attacked with arms.
=enemy falls over.

Thanks SuperSailor7.
Thank you for understanding, although it is unclear language.

Incidentally, the controller of the PlayStation style is popular also in Japan.
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The Red Spectra
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PostSubject: Re: controller setting for fighting games   Mon 07 Sep 2009, 1:39 am

As much as I like the Playstation controller, the Japanese Saturn controller was definitely my favorite peripheral for fighting games.

As far as joysticks go...I can't really say I've had the experience with them to really make up my mind about them (however, I do lean towards the ones with balltops). Actually, I'm thinking of picking one up for the 360 to play BlazBlue and not, you know, curse at my hands/the sky/other people (the 360 is awful for anything that's not GTA-clone or an FPS).
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EXTASY
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PostSubject: Re: controller setting for fighting games   Tue 06 Oct 2009, 12:54 am

The Red Spectra wrote:
As much as I like the Playstation controller, the Japanese Saturn controller was definitely my favorite peripheral for fighting games.
Saturn joypad is always my favorite joypad, I never find a joypad having a d-pad better than the saturn one, and moreover it has 6 buttons for my right thumb! I can play all Capcom fighting games with it nicely.

For some unknown reason I just couldn't find any 6 button joypad for pc in Hong Kong, which stops me from playing Street Fighter 4 PC cos I don't wanna play it with a 4 button joypad, but every single joypad I can find its a PS pad copy...

If it comes to a Valis fighting game, I guess I will prefer the following 2 layouts
1. A=punch B=kick C=weapon D=special
2. A=punch B=kick C=light weapon D=strong weapon
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The Red Spectra
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PostSubject: Re: controller setting for fighting games   Thu 08 Oct 2009, 2:53 am

EXTASY wrote:
The Red Spectra wrote:
As much as I like the Playstation controller, the Japanese Saturn controller was definitely my favorite peripheral for fighting games.
Saturn joypad is always my favorite joypad, I never find a joypad having a d-pad better than the saturn one, and moreover it has 6 buttons for my right thumb! I can play all Capcom fighting games with it nicely.
Seriously, it's like Sega and Capcom were in cahoots or something; it felt perfect.

EXTASY wrote:
If it comes to a Valis fighting game, I guess I will prefer the following 2 layouts
1. A=punch B=kick C=weapon D=special
2. A=punch B=kick C=light weapon D=strong weapon
I like set-up 2. Guilty Gear!
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gorori
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PostSubject: Re: controller setting for fighting games   Mon 12 Oct 2009, 10:14 am

This setup is used based on your opinion.

A=punch B=kick C=light weapon D=strong weapon.
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SuperDeadite
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PostSubject: Re: controller setting for fighting games   Tue 13 Oct 2009, 4:44 am

Sounds good. To me 4 buttons are enough for any game. I played many a Capcom 6 buttoner in the day. But I grew tired of them. The 4 button Neogeo layout is perfect.
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